Sunday, November 7, 2010

Phoney Pins

There were IBO’s we knew that became 1000 pins. Our Platinum would sneer at them that they were phoney 1000 pins and yes he was right. These suckers were putting thousands of dollars in Amway purchases on the credit card in a month so they could meet their upline’s goals and so they could “walk across the stage”.

Yeah so what? I appeared in ballet recitals when I was younger. I’ve pirouetted across a few stages in my time. Big deal.

Let’s see. Anyone upline checking to see if any of these 1000 pins actually have customers, especially the ones with no downline? Somewhere in the Amway rules it states how many retail customers one must have or some percentage before being eligible for a bonus check. Obviously our last sack of shit Platinum was well aware of the phoney pins and he wasn't doing his part by ensuring the downline had the required amount of outside of Amway retail customers.

I have no idea what the criteria is but I’m sure someone more familiar with those rules will chime in to the comment box. Maybe they’ll also chime in why nobody upline checks to see if the IBO has made sales to outside customers who are not in Amway.

I can tell you nobody upline checked that Ambot actually had customers before he got his $10 or $20 check each month depending on how much money he’d spent on Amway products.

I am happy to say during our last descent into hell that Ambot did not become a phoney 1000 pin. I don’t think he had that much space available on his credit card otherwise he’d have probably tried.

I am unhappy to say that Ambot did become a phoney 1000 pin during the first WWDB stint. His upline Platinum pushed him so she could meet some goal I guess. He spent all day on the phone trying to convince friends and relatives to buy products. I think he may have had a couple of friends commit to making small purchases but the majority of his purchases were for his own consumption, mainly vitamins. So he got his phoney pin and walked across the stage years ago. Whooppee!

Then the credit card bill arrived the next month and he’s sitting here staring at all these boxes of Double X that we’ll never use nor find anyone else to buy. There were other products as well. I just remember he bought a lot of vitamins.

He managed to return some for a refund which put his PV/BV into a negative situation. Also put his Platinum in a negative situation because the old battleaxe phoned to bitch at him about all his returns and point out he’d lost his eligibility for being a 1000 pin. I don’t think he cared anymore by that point. But get this. She bitches about buying him dinner because he met that level.

Ha ha! She’s bitching about dinner and we’d spent thousands of dollars on her Amway scheme. Who should be bitching at who here?

That’s one old bitch that I can only hope has frittered away her life savings on trying to build an Amway business.


  1. I wouldn't count on the usual suspects to give you a coherent answer on retail sales. The Amway defending addict is under the false impression that downline volume can be considered a retail sale.

    It's amusing but any rational person cannot consider that ideology to be factual.

  2. The requirement is 50 PV. You still get a check for personal consumption, just not any for downline volume bonus purposes. Amway has improved the reporting criteria, and we were literally taught by our upline how to "fake out" the computer in the earlier days. When I told Amway about this, they just shrugged their shoulders over the telephone. The reason the upline didn't enforce the retail rules is because they wanted their downline to put whatever money came from Amway into the tools. Also, it made the downline "feel" as if they were making money, so the upline could scam them for a longer period of time before most of them quit. Funny how it keeps coming back the Amway Tool Scam, isn't it?

    By the way, many of the upline were also wearing phony pins, but the Amway Tool Scam profit allowed them to live a lifestyle above the level of the pin they had earned at one time in the past. Funny how it keeps coming back the Amway Tool Scam, isn't it?

  3. Rocket, if he wants to come here and make a silly statement I'm sure the other usual suspects will make a fool out of him pretty fast!

    Tex, funny how I never associated phoney pins being part of the tool scam but I guess in the greater scheme of things that is correct. Like you said if the IBO's see tiny checks coming in showing they are making some money through their efforts in Amway the upline can keep them motivated to stay in longer and keep buying tools.

  4. That's why we're going to win our fraud lawsuit, I have all the facts needed and their relationship to each other in order to nail these bastards. I suggest you join us, but that's up to you.

  5. You're going to do well on your lawsuit, Tex. Its cheaper for Amway to settle so that way they don't have to make any changes. Proven again last week thanks to the link on Joecool's blog. Settle, don't admit doing anything wrong, don't make changes.

  6. The price goes WAY up if they don't make changes. Have you read about the settlement with Pokorny? It includes Pokorny and the others being directly involved in the change process on an annual basis.

  7. Just curious was it a good dinner at a fancy restaurant? I have never reached 100 pin or stayed long enough in the business to get anything free from my upline.

  8. Colin, I don't recall where we had dinner but I think it might have been a restaurant at the Sheraton where the rally was being held so it would have been a fairly decent restaurant.

  9. @rocketthecoward is lying, as usual. I have never stated that sales to downline count as a retail sale for the purpose of Amway's rules.

    It seems though, Anna, that you're saying that your husband was actively and knowingly breaking Amway rules to get bonuses/recognition he didn't earn?

    And it's his upline/Amway's fault for not checking better that he wasn't being dishonest?

  10. I doubt Ambot realized he was breaking Amway rules by not having enough outside customers. He was limited by the information the upline choose to give him. His Platinum several years ago was the one riding his ass and telling him to charge up his credit card so he could walk across the stage as a 1000 pin. I would say his upline are the ones knowingly violating Amway's rules. Did anyone upline or Amway really look further into somebody getting $8 and $9 checks if they're following the rules or is the amount so miniscule that they don't care? And how much money did he have to spend to get the whopping almost $10 monthly check? Well over $300.

  11. Ah, Steadson. Still trying to spin your way out of this one are you?

    ""If we ignore the fact that, virtually by definition, if you are selling to another Amway business then it's likely a wholesale sale, if your selling to an Amway IBO who is not operating a business, then "retailing" to them is clearly covered by "selling products""

    Lying? What would I have to gain by lying? Is everyone who doesn't agree with you a liar?

    That's right Steadson, it's her husband's fault. Nothing is ever Amway's fault.

    You're so predictable. I'll ask again (you won't answer) what level are you at after what, a decade? 15 years in Amway?

  12. Maybe IBOFB should try putting his spin on why IBO's are faking it till they make it and why Amway keeps getting sued for pretty much the same thing having to do with fraud on some level usually having to do with compensation IBO's can earn and the tool scam. If Amway's not doing anything wrong why do they keep settling and huge payouts. Perhaps we can get some of his prestigious insight on that.

  13. The $8 check was probably mostly for his own volume, not downline volume, right? If so, he had a right to that money, just not the additional downline volume bonus.

  14. Tex, we had no downline. Those $8 and $9 checks were his own volume.

  15. Then he was getting paid EXACTLY what he earned, he was NOT cheating, as ibofb accused him of doing, without asking this key question, as usual.

  16. He was limited by the information the upline choose to give him.

    How? The Business Reference Guide is on the website, and he would have received a copy when he joined. How was his upline stopping him reading the Amway website - which he would have needed to login to when ordering - and how did his upline stop him reading the rules he contractually agreed to?

    The idea that it was Amway's fault that your husband chose to break the rules is prime facie absurd. Amway already asked him when he signed the contract if he agreed to the rules, and he said he did.

    Should Amway assume people are dishonest and treat them that way?

    As for "why settle", do the math and it is obvious.

  17. As usual, ibofb is technically right, yet practically full of shit.

    Here's how it works: The upline signs you up, and states the rules are complex (and they are), so listen to the upline, they know the rules and how to interpret them, reading the rules is a waste of time. Later, you realize neither Amway or the upline had a SINGLE review of a SINGLE rule, when what should have happened is one or the other should have taught the rules on a regular basis, such as one rule per month, as there are 12 total rules. Bottom line - neither Amway or the upline WANT you to learn the rules, but only hold them against you should you ever get sideways with them. QED.

  18. Tex, you're more right than IBOFB.

  19. ibofb is intentionally lying. You get the straight scoop from me, and ibofb provides for plenty to scoop!


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